Jump to content

Attunement on DS access  

98 members have voted

  1. 1. Should players have to acquire FL NM clear achievement to access both DS dungeons and DS raid?

    • Yes, but make it account wide
      20
    • Yes, but make it character based
      31
    • Not sure
      4
    • No
      43


Recommended Posts

Hadralt    16
7 minutes ago, Sathus said:

Yes, its true, all PvE players hate all PvP players. In fact, we are currently working on a final solution to the pvp problem. 

Seriously though, i've never met any raid leader that will refuse a good player on the grounds that he is mostly interested in PvP. If you aren't being taken, its because you are bad, you won't have hitcap, you won't know the strats or something like that. You will usually not get a raid spot in a guild unless you are willing to commit, but pugs shouldnt be a problem. I've taken known pvp players as pugs when we needed people for some run and most of them performed okay. Its about if you can manage or not. 

I still agree on the "No", just not the reasoning.  

  I encounter this problem when I am looking for a pug, especially Shannox Heroic. Despite being 383 Ilvl and with the proper stats and even the achievement I am rejected. Every time I have done this encounter I have been top 1-3 in DPS and one of the only people in the pug not getting stuck in traps. As far as the rest of FL bosses, I have been searching for a while and never found a pug who would take a known PvP player. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Clem    82
Just now, Hadralt said:

  I encounter this problem when I am looking for a pug, especially Shannox Heroic. Despite being 383 Ilvl and with the proper stats and even the achievement I am rejected. Every time I have done this encounter I have been top 1-3 in DPS and one of the only people in the pug not getting stuck in traps. As far as the rest of FL bosses, I have been searching for a while and never found a pug who would take a known PvP player. 

You sure its not because people just dont like you? I mean no offence i dont mind you at all but sometimes i do see your attitude towards other people in global chat or anywhere else and you are not the most friendly person. Maybe thats the reason people dont take you and just use the pvp aspect as an excuse to not offend you since just like Sathus i also havent seen someone being rejected from raid because he is pvp player. Personally i think pvp players have easier time to do their job in raids since pvp-ing is more fast phased than pve and when it comes to reaction times like interupting stuff or moving away or into shit fast pvp players are most of the time better than anyone else. Either way if thats really happening (leaders not taking pvp players because they are pvp) then those leaders are shit and i wouldnt want to raid with them anyway :D

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Aethyr    8

Always been a big believer that people have the right to do what they wish to do, so therefore hearing raidleaders not taking known PvP players is rather rediculous on their part. As long as you are aware of the tactics and the gear that you possess is viable then I don't see an issue taking someone who mainly enjoys PvP, its ludicrous.

And what Clem said, PvP players are generally better at being more aware with their surroundings with quick reaction times.

 

I just don't want these dungeons to ruin the incentive in doing old raids. As those who do not have the chance to obtain the legendary, or simply can't be bothered won't do the raid. Since EoT dungeon gives the same type of gear as FL NM

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Hadralt    16
28 minutes ago, Clem said:

You sure its not because people just dont like you? I mean no offence i dont mind you at all but sometimes i do see your attitude towards other people in global chat or anywhere else and you are not the most friendly person. Maybe thats the reason people dont take you and just use the pvp aspect as an excuse to not offend you since just like Sathus i also havent seen someone being rejected from raid because he is pvp player. Personally i think pvp players have easier time to do their job in raids since pvp-ing is more fast phased than pve and when it comes to reaction times like interupting stuff or moving away or into shit fast pvp players are most of the time better than anyone else. Either way if thats really happening (leaders not taking pvp players because they are pvp) then those leaders are shit and i wouldnt want to raid with them anyway :D

I see what you mean, good point. I do tend to be an ass when someone says something I don't exactly agree with or even when i'm just bored and desperate for entertainment ;) I guess its a mild form of trolling/response to somebody who I think I know better than because of my years of playing this game.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Kirraq    119

Its funny how Infected is farming 6/7 HC weekly, thus doing better in PvE than some PvE guilds :D

Doing FL Normal once just to 'unlock' DS really isnt that hard, and if you plan on doing DS whats the problem with doing FL.

51 minutes ago, Hadralt said:

I do tend to be an ass when someone says something I don't exactly agree with

Thats called an opinion >.>

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Catchme    32
2 hours ago, Hadralt said:

I selected no. In the Dragon Soul patch pve gear becomes completely necessary for pvp. One thing to understand is that most pvp players suck at pve and even if they don't they hate it. In the event that they don't suck at pve and they don't hate it it is still nearly impossible to get the groups needed to clear a raid. PVE players hate pvp players and will never take us on raids. EVERY time I ask for a raid l, even when I have the achievement and the PVE gear I receive the answer "We are not taking PvP players". Also I dont think this should be required because we have had Firelands for over a year now and if people have not done it they really don't want to.

Hadralt, with all my love to you. That is probably the stupidest thing you have ever said. You simply cant expect invite for FL HC with pvp gear and only experience from Shannox (thats what ive noticed from you on world - "LF FL HC, 382 rogue"). Hell, you cant even expect invite to normal FL with full pvp gear from leaders that dont know you, because taking full pvp geared player to a raid is MOSTLY a huge fail.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Wolfenstein    172

The majority of the players have already done the Firelands, so personally, I don't see the requirement being nothing more than a frustrating obstacle for the small portion of the playerbase consisting of new players and alts, who will also have a harder time finding groups for it.

  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Aival94    31

I voted No and i would like also to give reasons for that.

 

First of all. To make such a system you need to have many checks. For example you will need to prevent somehow players buying gear either with jp,vp of higher tier or with gold. The server should have the hall content of this expansion in order for it to work much better. PVP items of higher seasons should also somehow be "banned" as some of them are much better than the previous tier. The Raids should be much more working so everybody will spend sometime to work on them. Many will complain about this "forced" way which they ask them to do sth they do not care anymore to do(while ofc others will just find it one really good idea).

I think your idea is really good but really need too much effort just to make the system fair and working good which make it a bad idea at least for now as the realm still develop and from what it used to be before a long time now the development is much slower.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Aethyr    8
3 hours ago, Wolfenstein said:

The majority of the players have already done the Firelands, so personally, I don't see the requirement being nothing more than a frustrating obstacle for the small portion of the playerbase consisting of new players and alts, who will also have a harder time finding groups for it.

Even if it's just the DS dungeons requiring FL NM?

I just worry about the older content will be obsolete. Apart from casters who are after the legendary staff 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Nilak    36

What Sniprep said actually makes a lot of sense. In my opinion that's something what every private server should do once they reach the last tier. Atlantiss is still a long way to that point but still it's something to consider. The idea of actually doing something productive instead of AFKing in Stomrwind/Orgrimmar sounds good.

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Aival94    31

@Nilak if you mean about the server go back to content i would like to tell you that the private servers need new content and not old repeatble contents. Such a thing will only work on a small playerbase of hardcore players but a server have 200-400 members who are on this list. Rest are different kind of players and private servers cannot just survive with so low pop so easy. Instead of going back the server should go forward or just give more content generally.

 

The idea of the system Aethyr gave is really good but the effort it need make it hard and need many requirements.

 

Ofc this is just my opinion.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Padthai    62
38 minutes ago, Nilak said:

What Sniprep said actually makes a lot of sense. In my opinion that's something what every private server should do once they reach the last tier. Atlantiss is still a long way to that point but still it's something to consider. The idea of actually doing something productive instead of AFKing in Stomrwind/Orgrimmar sounds good.

^ This. With some edits to the strategy but I like the general idea of it that Sniprep proposed.

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Nilak    36
38 minutes ago, Aival94 said:

@Nilak if you mean about the server go back to content i would like to tell you that the private servers need new content and not old repeatble contents. Such a thing will only work on a small playerbase of hardcore players but a server have 200-400 members who are on this list. Rest are different kind of players and private servers cannot just survive with so low pop so easy. Instead of going back the server should go forward or just give more content generally.

 

The idea of the system Aethyr gave is really good but the effort it need make it hard and need many requirements.

 

Ofc this is just my opinion.

By your logic no private server should exist :D

 

EDIT: People play on private servers because they want to experience a certain expansion, arena season, raid tier, etc. If I want to play Cataclysm (as I do), I'd rather play over and over in a current raid tier and arena season than being at the last tier.

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Melapes    5

You should only go to dragon soul, when you clean ragnaros hc, if not , whats the point ?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Pykeno    23

Why am i reading this? o.O

I lost half an hour of my life reading this post.I need to find girlfriend or some shit.A dog i guess.A lot easier.

Btw i voted no

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Paradoja    46
6 hours ago, Melapes said:

You should only go to dragon soul, when you clean ragnaros hc, if not , whats the point ?

Heroic Ragnaros? Wow.

I liked the second option of the poll, but as @Aival94 said, the effort it needs, makes it hard and need too many requirements.

It's not hard to have the Firelands achievement right now. If the Administration decides to make:

4.0 Dungeons completed > Tier 11 Raids N completed > Firelands normal completed > HoT dungeons > Dragon Soul

I will vote yes for it.

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Sphinx    15

By the logic of entering next T normal only if last Tier HC is completed we would have very very few Firelands around :D Id love to see how many groups could manage T11 HC without boost from T12 gear.

Like honestly, T11 HC with T12 gear, even half HC geaerd is still quite a fine challenge to tackle for most people (And really enjoyable, must say)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
boniboniboni    103

Replace the passion for wealth (ilvl) with the passion for dominance - make a leaderboard on the website, make an announcement on the server when someone kills a boss with a new record (fastest time, lowest ilvl, etc), reward them with cool tabards and vanity items. Maybe that will get the big guilds to cancel one of their 457387687 FL alt runs to do actual fun content (t11). Don't underestimate the power of comparing ePeens.

  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Bubalolz    0

I think the idea is a good one, but, it will become a waste of time once well of eternity and end of time are released, player will no longer need to run a full FL raid to get 378 gear, maybe for the 391, but if you think about it , DS is doable with 378 gear, so my answer is no to this pool, though, if people wanna really beat the *** out of ds bosses, it'd be good for them to get 391 gear.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Sphinx    15

Do notify that a vast majority of PvE players have their main raiding toon(s) geared way over EoT dungeon gear drops (With a small exceptions of Plater back slots, etc) which T12 Does not really provide much options for.

Those dungeons becoming locked would only prevent the flow of new players to catch up. And I dont know how majority here thinks, but personally, I would not recommend trying to land more obstacles to new players who wish to join in to play. The current population is by far from being overpopulated.

As Hadralt also mentioned, T13 PvE gear is a little out of hand powerful even for PvP. Giving extra restrictions to PvP-ers who do not enjoy PvE part of the game would give another negative blow.

Restricting freedom of choice in games has never been a successful move. One of the trump cards of open world MMORPG is the ability to CHOOSE. Yes, T11 and T12 loot table will become quite a joke. But there will still be lower raids done by those people who enjoy it. Not to mention for Transmog, by some who prefer Cata older tier appearances. Personally, I sometimes join random pug T11 Normals for fun on toons which are above 385. Point is, those who enjoy T11 and T12 will now and then do them regardless of loot.

But having some player iniative to compete versus one another might help revitalize T11, and with the opening of T13 to keep T12 alive as well.

Also a thing that would bring a small spark back to the value of T11 would be if Guild achievements would be fixed :). But this would still only reward a one-time-go. I mean I would even pay guildies for the Dark Pheonix guild achievement if that is what it takes - Being quite a fan of Pheonix mount (Not the Ragnaros one).

But yes, small things to bump up rewards from older tiers, at least in my eyes would be far more efficient. It could even be small things. Like otherwise unobtainable Transmog pieces. Boss dropping more gold? Whatever of the sort - I honestly suck in terms of thinking of rewards... So my ideas usually are, in a word, pathetic.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Catchme    32
34 minutes ago, Sphinx said:

Do notify that a vast majority of PvE players have their main raiding toon(s) geared way over EoT dungeon gear drops (With a small exceptions of Plater back slots, etc) which T12 Does not really provide much options for.

Those dungeons becoming locked would only prevent the flow of new players to catch up. And I dont know how majority here thinks, but personally, I would not recommend trying to land more obstacles to new players who wish to join in to play. The current population is by far from being overpopulated.

As Hadralt also mentioned, T13 PvE gear is a little out of hand powerful even for PvP. Giving extra restrictions to PvP-ers who do not enjoy PvE part of the game would give another negative blow.

Restricting freedom of choice in games has never been a successful move. One of the trump cards of open world MMORPG is the ability to CHOOSE. Yes, T11 and T12 loot table will become quite a joke. But there will still be lower raids done by those people who enjoy it. Not to mention for Transmog, by some who prefer Cata older tier appearances. Personally, I sometimes join random pug T11 Normals for fun on toons which are above 385. Point is, those who enjoy T11 and T12 will now and then do them regardless of loot.

But having some player iniative to compete versus one another might help revitalize T11, and with the opening of T13 to keep T12 alive as well.

Also a thing that would bring a small spark back to the value of T11 would be if Guild achievements would be fixed :). But this would still only reward a one-time-go. I mean I would even pay guildies for the Dark Pheonix guild achievement if that is what it takes - Being quite a fan of Pheonix mount (Not the Ragnaros one).

But yes, small things to bump up rewards from older tiers, at least in my eyes would be far more efficient. It could even be small things. Like otherwise unobtainable Transmog pieces. Boss dropping more gold? Whatever of the sort - I honestly suck in terms of thinking of rewards... So my ideas usually are, in a word, pathetic.

+1 for fixing raid achievements. Working t11 and t12 guild raid achievements would be cute.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Aethyr    8
3 hours ago, Bubalolz said:

I think the idea is a good one, but, it will become a waste of time once well of eternity and end of time are released, player will no longer need to run a full FL raid to get 378 gear, maybe for the 391, but if you think about it , DS is doable with 378 gear, so my answer is no to this pool, though, if people wanna really beat the *** out of ds bosses, it'd be good for them to get 391 gear.

You're missing the point

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Please sign in to comment

You will be able to leave a comment after signing in



Sign In Now
Sign in to follow this  

×